Please Help...Wattage Question for UTH

Good Evening,



My family is attempting to help two leopard geckos that we have just inherited. They were seemingly struggling in their tank environment which was filled with several inches of ground walnut shells with over-head lighting, a thermometer tape stuck high on the side of the glass, only one hide, and a water bowl. That's it...there no other items in the tank at all; no calcium, no under tank heat source, no humid area for sheading, no additional shelter.



Neither of the poor things seemed to be getting around very well and one was literally dragging her back legs and tail. (We currently have her soaking in warm water in hopes of releaving her apparent discomfort). We are very thankful to have found this forum in our hurried attempt to educate ourselves on how to help these sweet little creatures!



We have already found the instructions provided for how to best set-up the tank (30" x 12" x 12"). Thank you for the helpful information! It seems that nearly everything about their previous set-up was problematic! We have already dumped the loose substrate and now have paper towels in the bottom of the tank until we can make further improvements.



We have decided to use the peal and stick linoleum and have been to the store to purchase both the tiles and UTH but we wanted to double-check the wattage before adhearing anything to the tank bottom. The recommendation we found here on the forum seemed to indicate that the best wattage for the UTH would be a range of 7 to 12, but most UTHs at the pet stores were 16 watts. We did finally find one that is only 8 watts but it says that it specifically designed to be used in a humid or rainforest terrarium as opposed to a dry or desert terrarium.



We are confused by these choices and we don't want to make a mistake. Would someone please advise us as to whether we should use the 8 watt or the 16 watt? Both are 10" x 11" and are made by Exo Terra. We do have a very cool house, in fact we only heat to 55 degrees in the winter if that would make a difference.



Thank you, in advance, for any guidance you would be willing to provide!

The Politowicz Family

Hi there and welcome to the forum and for your nice compliments as far as your question, fist exo terra isn't the top end of uth's so I would opt for the higher 16 watt for a 30" tank since exo terra doesn't seem to get as hot as other uth. Their tagging things desert. And what not, all tham means is that uth operates at a higher wattage to try and produe more heat. Ignore the marketing and use the facts. You'll also want to get a rheotat or a thermostat to make sure your temps are under control since 10x11 will take up almost half your floor surface, that's a little bigger than I'm comfortable with but since you keep your house colder youl want to be sure to have the output to make optimum temps of 88-95*F.
Also I hope you got high end vinyl tiles to be. Sure if for some reason you don't have any problems with the cheaper adhesive that is on lower grade tiles. The thickness of your substrait will also affect your uth output. You don't have to stick the uth to the tank using the adhesive that's on it.. makes it hard to move...but you can take a piece of foil and use that on the outside of the uth and tape THAT to the tank insted. Make ure to poke some ventilation holes in the foil (draping it over a pillow and perforating it with a fork works well) so the uth can breathe. It will also help redirect most of the heat from the uth upwards.
So hope some of that helps good luck with you new friends. I'm ure they're much happier alreadu

Thank you for your response!



I must admit that I don't know how "high end" the tiles are that we ended up buying. We went to 3 local hardware stores trying to find 'peal and stick' that would not bend (since we read in this forum that stiffness was the marker of higher end tiles) and, yet, we finally gave up and just bought some that looked nice because they all seemed to bend a little. How can we tell if they are "high end" enough?



We saw lovely ceramic-type tile but, since we had read that the added thickness of those tiles might cause problems for the UTH device, we decided to simply choose the 'peal and stick' to insure the most reliable transfer of heat. Is this correct thinking?



Speaking of the transfer of heat, I truly did not know that there were UTHs that were better or worse! I am a complete and total novice just trying to help my family save these little geckos! Please excuse my fumbling while I figure all of this out! There is a lot to learn and much of what I read on the internet or hear from local pet stores seems to be unreliable so, undoubtedly, I am making mistakes despite my sincere efforts to avoid them!



We chose the Exo Terra because it came closest to 1/3 our tank size. Being that our tank is 30" x 12" x 12", 1/3 of the tank bottom would be exactly 10" x 12" and that is the dimension of this brand of heat mat. From you response it seems that you thought that our tank might be smaller because this mat will not cover 1/2 of the tank, but would you suggest that we get a mat that covers even less area?



Aside from a possible smaller size, are there other mat brands that you would recommend? There was a matt made by Zoo Med called Repti Therm available locally. It was also a 16 watt mat but I believe its dimensions were only 8" x 12". Would that be a better choice for our tank? Or are there any brands/sizes that would be even better than either of these two choices?



I do have one other pet store I could check with to see what they have available but until I know what the best size and brand are I am now unsure how to move forward. I really want to try to find something quickly because I don't know how long I can keep these little critters warm enough without an addition heat source. I actually left the bright light on all last night just because I was so worried that they would otherwise be too cold!



Also, I am very interested in your instructions of how to use the UTH without having to adhear it to the bottom of the tank, however I need to clarify the process. Would I make a foil sling to lay the mat on and then tape the foil to the bottom of the tank leaving the paper covering the slicky portion of the mat? Will the paper cause any fire safety issues if the mat is trying to heat through the paper, or did I misunderstand? Could you have meant that I was supposed to removed the paper and adhear the stickly portion of the mat directly to the foil? If so, then would I flip the mat so that the foil is not against the bottom of the tank? Will the mat still work if it is upside-down? I'm sorry for the questions and confusion! I just need and little more explanation to fully 'get the picture' in my mind.



And lastly, if there are better thermometers or thermostats or rheostats (I'm still not very sure what this is and whether it would be better or worse than a thermostat, as I'm still researching and trying to learn all of this stuff!) please provide advice so that I do not make more beginner mistakes and buy low quality materials as is apparently the case of the UTH. These leos have suffered enough and I don't want to add to their troubles!!!

Hi Arthur, I just wanted to say welcome and thank you for caring enough to take in these wonderful reptiles and helping them. You are in GOOD hands with kermit helping you!!

The ceramic tiles haven't actually hindered my heating for my two leo's. Infact, right now, in my tank the hottest spot (with an infrad heat gun) says 100.3F. But, it's your set up and I do agree the peel and stick tiles are good too.

Rheostats are a "dumbed down" version of thermostats. It actually throttles the electricity allowed to a device, and therefore the UTH wouldn't heat up to it's capacity. A thermostat on the other hand, you set at a temp and it it either pulses electricity to it to maintain the heat or it turns on till it reaches that temp and turns off if it goes over that temp.

Welcome to the forum! The way you say their walking sounds a lot like MDB; if it at all possible a qualified herp vet visit is highly recommended.

Hi smsararas2 and thank you for the very warm welcome!

Hi, as well, Kodieh! I have so much for which to thank you…

First, I appreciate you letting me know that you have had success with ceramic tile! Do you use a UTH with the ceramic? If so, what wattage do you use?

I am now wondering if it might be wise for me to abandon the idea of the ‘peal and stick’ tiles if I need to use a 16 watt heating mat since it quite likely will put out more heat than the 7-12 watt range mats that are recommended in this forum.

Secondly, I sincerely appreciate the explanation of the rheostat vs. the thermostat!

It sounds like a thermostat would be a bigger help in keeping the temperature regulated in my home since the room temperature can vary so widely and knowing that I will have to choose from a potentially under-powered mat (8W) or a decidedly over-powered one (16W).

I currently have purchased all the mats available locally! I have brought home:

the 10” x 11” Exo Terra Heatwave Desert (16 watt)

the 10” x 11” Exo Terra Heatwave Rainforest (8 watt)

and the 8” x 12” Zoo Med Repti Therm (16 watt)





I am still not sure of the best choice of mat, I have just bought everything so that whatever I learn from the opinions of the members of this forum, I will be ready…and I will take all of the other mats back to the various stores.

Still, I think from what you said that the thermostat would help in any wattage scenario. Is this correct? If so, is there a BEST thermostat? I have not been able to find a single one in the local pet stores. Is a thermostat something only found online?

I have also wondered about the option of using the lower powered mat (8W) with the thinner tile and simply seeing if additional heat would actually be required. If it were to be needed, could I simply use a heat bulb in an overhead fixture to adjust the temperature further upward?

I don’t know whether it would be easier or safer to provide extra heat from above, if needed, or have to deal with too much heat coming from below, if I were to use the higher wattage mat. I would love some opinions on this matter!

Thirdly, the little gecko that was having such trouble with her legs is MUCH better!

She seems to have benefitted from being soaked in the warm water. Although she is still struggling to pass anything through her system, she is definitely now able to use her back legs!

I did search out a herp vet and am grateful to know where to take this little gecko if she should stop improving. It is my hope, however, that she may not truly have MDB and that she may continue to improve!

Thank you, again, to all who have welcomed me and shared words of wisdom. Still, I need much more guidance! I am ready and willing to do more to help these little critters, but I would love more input in order to finalize a healthy and safe plan for their environment!

Please let me know what each of you would suggest as the best UTH brand/wattage/tile combination!!!

I would go with the Exo Terra mats, to begin with. They aren't peel and stick UTH's and are therefore returnable if you do use them to test with. I would personally pick what you would like to go with, the 8 watt or 16; then based on that go with a matching substrate choice. I feel like the 8 watt would do better with peel and stick tiles and the 16 watt would do well with the ceramic tile.

Hi, again, Kodieh!



Thanks for the recommendation of the Exo Terra mats!



I did want to let you know that the mats I have from that company are both self adhesive. Maybe Exo Terra makes more than one style, but the mats available to me locally are all sticky-backed.



Does this information change your opinion of the best choice for my situation?

Ok long reply coming
First kodie answered a lot of the heating questions very well. Thanks for the confirmation kodie they wernt peel and stick uth,but if you do have self adhesive you might want to exchange for one that's not, so fo the op the foil sling we were talking about would work perfectly. If you go wth the vinyl tile the 8 watt will be fine. My viv has a 6x11 7 watt t rex cobra heat mat and I've seen it hit 110 during testing and the tiles didn't bleed glue, didn't offgas plastic smell. They performed fine. If you are skeptical and decide to go with slate, marble,granite or another natural stone substrait and its less than a half inch thick with the glass of the viv floor then the 8 watt could still work but you may need a moonlight blue bulb on some colder nights. A 75 watt bulb will add about 6 degrees to your overall temp. If you use porcelain or ceramic tiles I would go with the 16 watt mat as ceramic and porcelain are insulators, think coffee mug here, not conductors like natural stone.
Personally I prefer rheostats (light dimmers work well) id rather have a constant supply of consistant heat rather than have my uth perform 100% until it reaches temps then shuts off. All that on and off on the mat not only shortens the life of your mat but ups your electric bill. The biggest problem there until you learn how your equipment performs is to check your temperatures a lot. Adjust the dial up or down to suit the range you need. A thermostat will be what "checks" the temps for you but depending on the quality of the therostat some can be up to 5 degree delay between what you set it for and what it actually hits before the thermostat reacts. So even if you have it set at 93, it could get up to 98 before it shuts off or as low as 88 before it turns on.
I can't recall if you have a calcium dish in the viv but you need one for that weak one. At this point I would use calcium wth D3 until their eating regulary and you know they're getting enough D3 thru the multi vit.
Hope that helps clear up any other questions you had on the uth wattage

I could've sworn the heatwave's weren't peel and stick, but that'll make it tough to exchange them since their usually one shots when it comes to use.

It's good to hear from you, again, Kermit!



I am very happy that you think the 8W mat used in combination with the thinner 'peal and stick' tile would work well!



I am also extremely grateful for the time you took to explain the advantages of a rheostat. Your explanation really helped! Also, I saw a rheostat at one of the pet stores I visited so I know that I can get that quickly. Hooray!



I did put a tiny, shallow dish of Flukers Calcium with Vitamin D3 in the tank. I think it is actually meant to be used as sort of a "Shake and Bake" type application material for the geckos live food, but it was all I could come up with to provide a calcium supplement. Please let me know if this is a mistake!



Unfortunately all the mats I have available are sticky-back, including the brand that Kodieh had suggested, therefore I do need to ask you to help me better understand your plan for using foil.



I am sorry that I did not "get it" the first time you tried to describe the system! Do you leave the paper backing on to cover the sticky adhesive and simply place the paper against the bottom of the tank? Does this present a fire hazard after the paper has been heated for a long time? How long have you used this method?



I beg your patience with my many questions. I am learning a lot and my entire family and the geckos all deeply appreciate your continued help!

Hi Kodieh,



Yes, sadly they are all self adhesive so there could be no exchange. Knowing that, would you still think that the Exo Terra would be the best choice between that brand and the Repti Therm?

It's pick and choose really, neither brand in my opinion has the secret to perfect heat radiation; their both the same on some level.

Ok, Kodieh, thanks for the input! I appreciate your opinion and it is reasurring to know that I really can't make a big mistake going with one over the other.

The problem with one over the other is what type of heating filament they use and how it heats. If it's a pulse mat then you'll have waves of heat rather than a consistant heat output at a certain temperature. The other issue is that those that use a lesser grade filament will burn out faster than a uth that uses copper filament like the cobra heat mats do. Copper wire is the best you want to have for a heating element. Even better would be copper bands rather than wire. Those are near impossible to damage, and the mats that use them aer also usually moisture resistant.



As far as the sticky goes, you can use a light coating of desert sand to kill the sticky (make sure it is a light coat and you shake any excess off. Remember yuo just want to kill the sticky and not make a thick layer of sand on the uth) and then use the foil hammock to install the uth. The foil hammock is pretty easy to make, 2 layers of foil about an inch bigger all the way around than your uth. Drape it over a pillow and use a fork to perforate the foil with a fork (or any utensile) so it can breathe. Poke several holes in it's entire surface area to achieve this. Then you tape the uth to the foil, the back of tyhe uth agasint the face of the foil so when you install it the proper side is facing up. Then you tape the foil to the underside of the tank,. Duct tape will work well for both applications, just make sure when you tape the uth that youre staying on the edges and not going into the heating field. Using the foil backing will also make sure the majority of your heat is directed upwards and you won't lose any thru the bottom of the mat. I find this particularly helpful with lower quality mats that have troubles heating up to the desired temperature range.



There is no need to keep apologising for all the questions or for further explanation of something,... we were all there at one point and it is a learning process. We here to help and we love the questions. That means you're interested in what's best for your leos and THAT'S what matters most

Adding to what Kel said, before long you'll be like us and jumping in with your own bits of advice.