Mouth problems ?

I went to the vets today to have this checked out. It wasnt the normal vet I see and personally I wasnt happy with her. She didnt handled them well, and didnt seem to know alot about reptiles in general.



The vet told me the marks within their mouth was pigments. I know Ally has always had some black on her gum, but it seems to have got worst. And now Dotty, Lizzie and Custard have it.



I had to pop to my local pet shop for food so asked in there. He took a look at them, and he said they look like bites from the live food Im feeding them.



There is no other signs. Everyone is eating likes pigs apart from Ally (which has just laid a clutch of eggs, and she goes off food for a week after laying eggs we find) no swelling to the mouth, no bleeding or pus.



We feed them all on either normal sized mealworms of marioworms. I know a marioworm has bite ally in the past, so could be the same reason. Here is so photos to help explain...



Allys mouth - She has black gums on one side and black spots on roof of her mouth







Custard just has them on the gums







Lizzie has some black spots on gums (she droped her tail so didnt want to stress her out more and take photos)



Dotty has some on her gums (she has enigma sydrome so didnt want to stress her out)



Cookie is completely clear and has no form of blackness within her mouth

It looks like it could be residual damage from possible bites from a MORIOworm or it could be spotting pigment, but if it were bites in my opinion there would be scabbing as well as swelling and redness which Im not seeing. It could be the starts of mouth rot or some other bacterial/viral infection as well. It is definitely something to keep an eye on.

Also if you wre dissatisfied with the vet that saw your animal you should complain and demand your money back or a repeat visit with out charge with your regular vet. This is why it pays to be specific when booking an appointment with a clinic that has more than 1 vet, ask for the one you want SPECIFICALLY by name. Don't settle for second best when it comes to the health and welfare of your animals.

Thanks for your view. We will keep a eye on it. They have all gone back onto locusts for the mean time. Ally has had the black on her gms for some time now.Sam might be able to tell me more, as it was hers before I brought her (maybe she had some pigments when she was in sams care)



It will be kept a close eye on before. I know when Ally got bitten last time, it was the same type thing, black and than it kinda scabed up and got better. Maybe the same will happen to these.



It was a free appointment due to being a new member (was put under boyfriends name not mine) so cant really complain. But if things get worst or doesnt seem to improve than I will make another appointment with the vet I normally see. Thanks for your imput though

You're welcome for the imput... just an FYI... if it started with 1 and now all 3 in the community are displaying symptoms I highly doubt it is feeder bites... all of them having the same feeder bites is HIGHLY unlikely and they would likely STOP eating those bugs if they were hurting them. I have to say I am leaning more towards a bacterial/viral issue honestly.

As far as the vet visit goes, I honestly wouldn't care if it was free or not, you were dissatisfied... they need to make it right honestly. If you let it go then you're just permitting them to take advantage of the next person who comes in with a herp and an issue. They might have intentionally offered the less qualified vet for the free visit knowing you'd be unhappy and back with in a week for a paid visit with your regular vet. Doing it in your BF's name to get the free visit then taking in the animal yourself when you already have a history with that vet didn't send off any red flags?

Well personally so am I at this moment in time. But the thing is, we have never tried to look into Custards mouth because he is a little biter than you put fingers near. And Dotty we tend to leave her alone due to the problem of enigma sydrome. We though are keeping a really close eye on them all to see whats going on.



If it is a bacterial problem. Would I need to go back to the vets or could it be treated at home ? It doesnt matter if I do have to go back and ovbi the health of my gecko comes way before money!



Fair enough totally see where you are coming from there. She is more to do with fluffy animals like dogs rabbits etc. They were his geckos and he made the account yesturday when I took mine in. Red flag maybe, but than again maybe not. The vet has seen and knows what my geckos looks like. So seeing some new ones of a different named account could be okay

For any type of suspected bacterial/viral infections cultures would need to be taken and type specific antibiotics prescribed so it is likely not something you can do at home, sorry. If you do end up taking them infor all that make sure you get a probiotic as well as any antibiotic regimen will ruine your leos natural gut flora and cause GI issues.

Okay no worries. And thanks for the advice about the type of probiotic i would need.



I have personally just checked all my leopard geckos (with clean hands) and none of them have anything similar, so pointing more towards it being a bacterial problem.



But ally has always have some black within her mouth. So surely it should be 10x worst by now.We have had her almost a year

that would depend on the type of bacteria, how invasive it was and ally's tolerence and natural immunity. She could, at this point, just be a carrier that isn't affected by the bacteria whereas the other leos are just finally getting a good dose of exposure to it making them reactive. Again it could be, it could not be, only a vet would be able to say for sure with mouth swabs and a culture but it still warrants caution and proper quarantine handling.

Yes I suppose.



Proper Quaratine and washed hands etc/cleanness are always a good must have in my routine

i cant remember ally having any black bits in her mouth when i had her but it was a year ago, im seeing my vet on monday so will ask him what he thinks about it and let you know



i currently have a female with some black bits but never really been worried about it as she still eats and gains weight and looks healthy

Okay cool.Thanks yea let me know if he says anything. The vet today was completely useless !



Anyways yes this is what i cant remember either its just under a year actually lol Well they all look healthy and she has only loss a little bit of weight due to the eggs. But they all eat and when she isnt laying she was eating fine

I'm not sure how common mouth rot is, but those don't look like bites personally.

Mouth rot can set in rather fast from something as simple as a feeder bite and happens more often than you'd think. It's pretty scary stuff since by the time we actually notice it, its already in a more advanced state. Really how often do you ever look that closly at your leos mouth just because...

Honestly, I've never looked inside my leo's mouth. I might start doing a weekly check just cause, haha.

mouth rot doesn't look like that it starts as yellow crusty bits or chunks normally that can easily be picked out and removed but then they need a course of anti-biotics to clear it up and it stops them from eating. I only know this cos i've had 3leo's get it last year just after i got them.

Hm, then I honestly couldn't comment as to what this is. :S

So if it doesnt look like mouth rot what else could it be ?

Could it be dirt or pieces of food. One of my leos had something similar and I took a q-tip and rubbed it and it was chunks of cricket...gross but it was gone.....

If you honestly want t know have the vet do a mouth swab and culture. It could be bacterial or viral... something like thrush. You won't know until you do a swab until then its just speculation and we certainly can't replace the qualified vets hands on attention. If nothing comes of the cultures then possibly chalk it up to freckles or if it rubs off with the swab then food particles. Only other option is a small skin biopsy to look at it in a cellular level to rule out any melanomas. Highly unlikely but a possibility none the less.
If you want an absolute answer there are absolutely ways, it all depends on how much you're willing to spend, how much stress to the leo... is it worth it, and what quality of life your leo has with it as it is. Those are the things I would think about if it were my leo

okay thanks

Just to let everyone know. I checked Ally's mouth yesterday and everything seems fine, the black is actually going on its own cord, We have been changing water every day (or before that time if it looks horrible) and it seems to have healed. maybe it was bites after all. If they go we will still keep a very close eye on in case anything else come up we are not happy with. And we have changed them onto standard mealworms with locusts rather than those nasty marioworms

Glad to hear shes looking better but before you say those nasty morioworms keep in mind the damage done t poor chocolates tail from regular meal worms and I know I've gotten some pretty wicked bites from locusts so...any feeder can bite, which is why I always suggest giving morios a little pinch first to stun them a bit. Eros always grabs those lil buggers right by the head then chomp chomp crunch they're done before he even sucks the rest in.

Fair enough. And yes I know any live food can bite. But personally I've never had a problem with normal mealworms, or locusts. I have checked Lizzie s mouth (due to her growing her tail back) but the other 3 are all cleared up And like I said on your other thread about superworms the boyfriend use to offer tail first (so that spike could be the main problem)

There's a good reason to tong feed a little differently. You're not really suppose to let your herp grab the food out of the tweezers but actually should drop it in front of your leo so he can grab it the way his instincts dictate he aught to. There's a lot less chance of injury from improper eating if we don't interfere so much. What the spots on the lips could have been was hitting the tweezers and bruising, and the spots in the mouth could have just been shell particles but I'm glad to hear its working out .

Glad it is working itself out