Help!!!

Dear whoever can help,
I have a patternless male gecko named Vinny, he's about 3 years old, and I think he is starting to get MBD.
My first gecko I owned died from MBD when he was only 1, I didn't know how to help him. I dusted his food but I guess since it was a while since his disease had took its course it had no effect.
So far, Vinny's tail is starting to get mishapen at the end. I don't know if he is starting to get MBD or he has some other illness. When he sheds, some of his old skin stays on his fingertips. The area on his underside where his tail meets his torso looks a little swollen and is dirty.
My other leo, Noel, is a girl and is skinny right now due to laying eggs. Vinny has shown a dramatic weightloss within the past few weeks also, so I decided to go to the store to buy something to help. I just syringe fed both of them Fluker's Repta+Aid Critical Care Formula. I don't know what else to do because I don't even know what Vinny's condition is. Please help!

Hi and welcome to the forum.
First of all, some picture's would be a sure sign for us to identify whether or not its MBD.

The shed skin issue could be due to your substrate or lack of moist hide. Providing a moist hide, with moss or wet kitchen roll in will help him shed with ease. If you wish to remove the shed yourself then a shallow tub of warm water will help loosen the skin.

The area i think you mean is the vent, and it can be a bad sign if it has feces smeared on it. It can also mean nothing. Most often it comes from runny feces which can mean parasites.

Its important to make sure that these two gecko's are not housed together at the moment, due to her skinnyness and his potential illness.

There are other members which are far more experienced with MBD and so may be a better help.

If you could please take a minute to copy and paste our care questionaire (it's a sticky at the top of the health section) we'd appreciate it. The info will better equip the membership to what could be causing your problems.

Considering this is something potentially affecting both leos you should likey take a fecal sample to the vet to rule out parasites and keep the leos. Seperated.

Welcome to the forum.

Thank you both for replying, your help is greatly appreciated! I don't think I can take Vinny to a small animal vet as I am only 15 and can't afford it. I usually soak him in warm water to get the skin off, I just didn't know what was causing it. So if the vent having feces smeared on it is it a bad sign? I don't know how to help him with that, when he was soaking in the warm water I picked him up to look him over and some feces was sticking out of the vent, like he was constipated. I pulled it out and some more came out easily with it, but it still doesn't look right. i don't know if what I did was bad or if it hurt him, but I didn't know what else to do! I don't know if this can be connected to the change in his diet. I usually feed both of them mealworms. When I first got him I was feeding my other leo waxworms, as they are said to be high in fat, so I fed him those too. After a while I switched back to mealworms because they're cheaper. They've been eating mealworms for the past 2 years or so and I just bought them some waxworms a few weeks ago, could that have affected them?

About your leo:
- Male
- About 3 unkown weight
- Morph unknown
- Got my first leo 6 years ago
- Petco
- Captive bred
A) Health/History
- Rarely, I don't want to hurt them
- Descriptions are listed in my post
- None
B) Fecals
- Now, yes as said above
- Last time he ate, probably a few days ago
C) Problem
- Listed above
Housing:
A) Enclosure
- 10 gallon
- Glass tank with screen top
- White vitamin sand
- None, used to have one with vermiculite
B) Heating
- Heat bulb on tob and 2 heat mats under each house right now as it is still cold
- Thermometer says 80
- Thermometer
- Stick on thermometer- Do you have any lights (describe type and cycle duration)
C) Cage mates
- One other leo, female albino
- Just being skinny when she starts to lay eggs
Describe Diet:
A) Typical diet
- Mealworms
- Every week
- Tongs
B) Supplements
- T-Rex Leopard Gecko Dust
- None
- Dish inside tank with supplement 24/7, dust mealworms rarely, they don't seem to like the taste so they stop eating when they taste that I'm dusting them
- Don't gutload anymore

It really would have been MORE helpful if you actually would have copied and pasted the WHOLE questioaire insted of just publishing your answers.... believe it or not we don't have the questionaire memorized...

I'm seeing several things wrong with your husbandry... First off you're keeping him on sand which causes impactions esp. if it's mineral sand, that just encourages them to eat more of it.Also the sand could be to blamefor the issues with your leo's vent area. Sand is very irritating and harbours a LOT of bacteria... Get him off the sand. Either use natural stone tiles or high end vinyl times or regular paper towels for substrait. Pet shops are dead WRONG encouraging people to use reptisand or mulch type substraits with these animals. They do NOT come from loose sand deserts, they come from packed earth deserts and live in the rocky craigs and crevaces in the mid desert level.

Next thing... you're not getting accurate temperature readings... and if you are 80*F is MUCH too low. You need an optimum temperature range of 88-95*F for optimum health. I'm really surprised you aren't making temps with 2 heat mats and a heat lamp. You need to get a probe thermometer (at wal mart or home improvement stores for under $10 or a pet shop) and place it on the floor directly above the uth for the most accurate temp readings. Those stick on thermometers are WAY inaccurate. Ambient (air) temps don't mean squat to a leo, it's belly heat that is most important. You have a 10 gallontank so 1 6x8 or 6x11 uth should suffice. You need a temperature gradient in the tank from hot to cool side so your leo can thermoregulate. Place a single UTH on one side of the tank and it should take up about 1/3rd of the floor surface. There's your hot side... cold side needs NO heating... no light no uth nothing... just let it be at room temperature. Next... lighting... leos DO NOT need a basking light, a UV light or any time of suppimentallighting. They are too bright and cause stress and esp. with red eyed leos can cause pain. Leos are crepuscular (not noctournal) they are most active at sunset and before sunrise. The light that comes in thru a window is enough to help them regulate their day/night cycle. If your leo is in an acceptionally dark room then a simple 15 watt incandescent bulb will suffice to establish his day/night cycle buput it on a timer and match your local sunrise/sunset times for settings. You'll need to adjust it occasionally with the seasonal changes (as daylight is less in winter) but that's not a big deal.

Also seeing as how your leo is on sand and has already had shed stuck on his feet, you absolutely need a moist hide to aide in shedding. You can use a regular tupperware dish with a hole cut in the side or top filled with damp paper towels or sphagnum moss.

Next you're keeping a male and female together... they WILL breed... do you know how to take care of a pregnant female or the eggs? Even if you do they should be seperated as 1 is sick and a 10 gallon tank is MUCH too small to house 2 adult leos in,. You need a 20 long minimum to house 2 adult leos in. Leos are not communal animals and do not crave the company of other leos. They get together for breeding then that's it. Please seperate them until your other leo is healthy again. Communal living is another BIG stressor for leos.

You say you don't handle your leo because you don't want to hurt him... well how are you going to have him hand tame if you should need to help get off stuck shed or administer medication? You HAVE to handle your leo at least 1-2x a week. If you're careful and calm you won't hurt them. Just use your head. Sit on the couch or your bed and let them walk on you. Making sure your leo stays active will help with GI motility and constipation. Movement makes movements if you will.

Now for suppliments and feeding... all wrong... you are using T-Rex brand leopard gecko dust... that is an all in 1 suppliment, you do NOT leave it in your tank. The only time you leave a suppliment in the tank is calcium, plain regular calcium. Your leo can overdose on a multi vitimin like the leopard gecko dust and it must be used under supervision. For adult leos dust every feeding or every other feeding with this, do not leave it in his tank. You risk hypervitaminosis (please google it). When using an all in 1 suppliment you shouldn't have to leave a calcium suppliment in the tank. He should get all he needs thru the suppliment if you're dusting properly. If you suspect mbd then leave the plain calcium in the tank and that's it. If your leos don't like the taste you can dab your finger in a little water then the suppliment and dab it on their mouth/nose (do not get it in their nostrils). They'll lick it off thus by getting properly supplimented. If your leo is eatng 5 mealies in a feeding then do this 5 times (dip and dab according to how many feeders they're eating so they get the proper amount of suppliment). How are you dusting your feeders? You should just put them in a small sandwich bag or small tupperware dish with the suppliment, swirl then around in it to lightly coat and feed to your herp.

Lastly since your leos aren't getting properly dusted gutloading is VERY important at this point. You need to gutload your feeders with fresh veggies (no spinach or toomatos tho). Potato, carrots and apples (minus the seeds/core) make the best gutload along with broad leafy greens. You should be taking bugs you plan on feeding to your herp and start gutloading them 48 hours before you plan on feeding them to your leo. This way your leo is getting optimum nutrition from their feeders. Also being adults you might want to switch to superworms. Less shell, more protein and less fat than mealies plus an adult leo will only need 2-5 per feeding so more economical.

Lots of things to fix here before you can say that your leo is getting MBD... MBD isn't reversable but it is manageable and your leo can still live a happy healthy life. Making these changes will be crucial to your leo's health. What you could be seeing (since you haven't posted a pic of the sick leo for us to see if it is mbd or something else. Please do that if you can) is simply an overly stressed leo that is shutting down from improper husbandry. Good luck.

I just want to again stress the importance of these leo's being seperated.

Its the worst possible thing for both of them. If she lays any eggs i suggest you freeze them or pop them and then throw them out, to ensure they don't hatch, because honestly, your not ready for breeding or hatchlings.

Secondly, if she is skinny, then that is a size difference between them straight away, gecko's of different sizes shouldn't housed together, purely because a fight can break out at any point and the bigger one will do the smaller one a lot of damage. A LOT of damage. ESPECIALLY if she is weak from egg laying, pregancy and possible illness, then there is a likely chance you will lose her if a fight happens to break out.

And a fight IS likely to break out at some point, because of the stress these leo's must be in. Anything could make them flip and hurt each other.

Any potential illness the male has the female now has too. So if he is ill then you have doubled any vet costs.

Also, everything that is wrong with your husbandry which was mentioned above by Kermit, BOTH of these gecko's are going through so both of these gecko's are stressed to no end.

You need to seperate them immediately. You say you have two heat mats, so stick one of them into the biggest tub you can find, with some kitchen roll as substrate and one of your UTH under one end. Keep the female fed well since she is laying and when she is done, don't breed her again.

I took several pictures but I can't figure out how to post them onto the forum. Is it 100% unsafe to house them together? Vinny has been housed with Noel since the first day I bought him. They never fight and always sleep next to eachother. All her eggs are infertile, they all look like deflated balloons. I will start handling them more often, thank you for the recommendation. What is the best way to reconstuct their cage? I'm already going to put their vermiculite tupperware back into their house. Any other suggestions? Thank you both for all your help! It really means a lot!

right here's a little guide of how to post a picture:

First you want to click the little button with a picture on it and little floppy disk.

[/url]

Which will bring up the box in the picture.

Then click 'Browse..' and choose your file.
Once you have chosen your file, choose to resize it or not, 640px is the best size.
and click 'Host it'

Then this will come up:
[/url]
Then, copy and paste the second line of code into the test box/post editor.

When you post your post it will show up.

OR if you are in WYSIWYG mode. (switch in and out of this mode by clicking button) then what you want to do is, instead of copying the second line of code, you want to copy the third line of code.

And then click on the box of a picture without a floppy disk on, and paste the code into this box and click okay. Your picture will then appear in your post editor/text box for you move around and resize etc.

It would only let me upload two, then it tried to make me download something, but i don't want any viruses

is your leopard gecko a blizzard??

the tail tip is normal for a leo thats lost part of its tail and regrowning/regenerating it.
Normally I house only females of the same size togther all year round and keep my males on there own, unless im using them to breed.
All of mine are kept on kitchen roll, with a moss box, water bowl, food bowl and house.
hope this helps

However Mari, the housing Sam mentioned above is for breeding purposes and for people who have a lot of experience.
The housing you would be better off with is all explained in the post by Kermit.

As Sam mentioned, your gecko's tail is regenerated, meaning it has dropped off at some point in its life and he has grown it back.

Its definitely unsafe for them to be housed together, it will be very hazardous to their health and current state. The eggs will likely become fertile throughout the season though, in which case you need to make sure they are destroyed before throwing them out.

I wish you luck, keep us posted.

PS, your leo's probably sleep next to each other because its the best spot, not for each others company.

He's had his tail missing since the day I got him , I bought him that way. The segmented part on the end always looked different, but it's starting to look different, like it's wrinkled. Can you help with the type of leo he is?

Is it possible that he has some shed stuck on his tail? I'd be soaking I and applying a little mineral oil to keep it mositurized until his next shed. I'm not great at morps but would thst be a sunglow?

he looks like a blizzard or patternless but jordan is the best with morphs

i thought he was blizzard straight away after seeing the tail he is gorgeous whatever he is Jordan, is it a blizzard?

I could also be wrong but I think he is a Murphy's Patternless. He is pale with hi tail being lighter than the rest. Jordan can correct me on this if I am wrong.....lol!

Lol, all crying out for Jordan. Yes its a blizzard, possible a blazing blizzard as albino normally produces that yellow tinge.
A clear eye shot would allow us to tell if its an albino Mari.
And if it is an albino it means it is a blazing blizzard.

eee! knew it was a blizzard!

Is he something special? I got him for only $10!

yeah... blizzards are my favourite morph of leopard gecko.I'm kind of obsessed with them.. they are beautiful ^ ^ lucky you!

:O i wish i could get one for $10 lol

Wow, yeah that is quite a bargain, i would price them at like $60.
Especially if it is a blazing blizzard.

Its a very nice gecko and you have definitely been lucky to get it.

Babies were on sale and I had a Petco coupon lol. He has green on his eyelids, does that still mean he's a blizzard?

Yes it does, it's just the way the lighter colored ones look.